E32 Repowering—Update
Date: August 5, 2014
From: George A. Zahn
Paul,
My time has come to consider replacing my Yanmar 2QM20 engine in my 1976 Endeavour 32 (CB). I know that by now, most owners of similar model boats have made the move and I want to learn from their experience. What engine has proven to be the best fit? That is one that can be fitted without major rework of the foundation /mounting pattern already in the boat. For those who wanted a bit more power, what was their choice? I would like to hear from any one who has any suggestions or input.
Thanks, George Zahn
Gloucester VA
Date: August 11, 2014
From: Philip Dukas
Paul - I am installing a 3gm30 in my Endeavor 32. You mentioned (14 years ago) that many owners are replacing their original engines with the Yanmar. However, the Endeavor rake angle is just larger than the maximum 15 degrees recommended by Yanmar. Do folks use a down angle transmission, or just drop in the Yanmar on the original rails with a straight transmission?
The 2QM20 in our E32 is still running, but I don't have confidence in it for longer trips. I settled on the Yanmar 3GM30(F) as the replacement, but was concerned about the specification for the maximum prop shaft angle, or rake, of 15 degrees. The rake on my E32 is approximately 17 percent. I received some helpful advice from a forum member that successfully installed the 3GM30 and did not encounter any oil starvation or other problems.
I downloaded the Yanmar installation manual that provided the detail. The "maximum allowable static installation angle" is 15 percent, but the allowable "inclination during constant operation" is 20 percent, with a "peak inclination (for less than 10 seconds) of 25 percent". So I suppose the key value is the 20 percent maximum inclination, greater than the 17 percent of the E32.
The engine bed width seems to be the only remaining challenge. The Yanmar installation manual (at 600 pages) contains detail that I did not find in any other document.
Thanks again for your help, Paul. Moving on to the next step! Regards... Philip
Date: August 11, 2014
From: Don Reeder
I replaced my 2qm20 with a 3ym20. I had to increase the angle so I built new stringers over existing stringers and left the prop shaft the same. Hope this helps.
Date: August 11, 2014
From: Philip Dukas
RICHARD -- Thanks again for the advice. I contacted Essex Boat Works, and Mark was extremely helpful -- especially considering that I will likely never cross his path. He did not do the work on your boat, but knows the E32 and 3GM30, and says he is positive the mounting angle could not have been changed -- no down angle trans, etc. So with your good experience with the Yanmar/E32 -- I am ready to descend into the hole. As a token of appreciation, I mailed a small donation to your Sea-Legs organization at Guthrie Place.
PAUL -- And thanks for suggesting the broadcast. I cannot believe I had my answer within a day. Thanks again for your site.
Date: August 13, 2014
From: George A. Zahn
Richard and Philip,
At Paul Uhl's suggestion I am contacting you for any information you may be willing to share regarding replacement engines for an E32.
My Yanmar 2QM20 is currently being evaluated as to repair (head is off for possible rework and replacement of injectors). Not sure where I stand at the moment butneed to be prepared for replacement. First suggestion was a Yanmar 2GM20, or a 3GM30 for a bit more power, but then I just heard of possible inclination limits. Are there other engines which are reasonable to use? Has any one gone through suchh a change out and what has been the experience?
Any response will be greatly appreciated.,
George
Date: August 13, 2014
From: Philip Dukas
I am more than willing to share my experience, but you should know this is my first major diesel decision, so I carry limited experience. I have owned the E32 for a year, and absolutely love the boat.
My 2QM20 is running well at a core level, but numerous systems need to be replaced -- water pump, lift pump, injector lines, etc. And since it is raw-water cooled, everyone advised that internal corrosion on a 35-year-old engine was about to catch up to me, so I should not make any major investment in maintenance. I cannot justify a new engine ($10-15,000), but the "used engine" strategy can also start to add up if a lot of modifications are necessary (such as new beds, shaft, etc.).
When I mentioned the rake angle to a few knowledgeable folks, they said the newer Yanmars do not have the oil sump configuration of the 2QM20 that allows a 17-18 degree mounting. The options described included a new Beta, or adding a down-angle transmission to a Yanmar (which would have necessitated a new engine bed). And the down-angle transmission is extremely hard to find.
Paul Uhl put me in contact with Richard, who provided the name of the boat yard that installed a 3GM30 in his E32. Richard reports good success with this combination, on the original mounting rails (so still at 17-18 degrees). I later found a great Yanmar installation manual that stated that 20 degrees is the maximum angle while underway (with a peak of 25 degrees for 10 seconds or less). Since the sailboat is not a planing hull, I assume installation angle = running angle (+/- a few degrees). So I think I am going to try it.
I found a great 3GM30 here in NC for $2700. I compared the mounting specs for the 2QM20 and 3GM30, and I think the only major modification is to add some angle aluminum brackets to the rails -- the 3GM30 is about two inches narrower than the 2QM20. And I found that the simple solution (adding an extension to the engine mounting brackets) won't work -- the engine will no longer vibrate with the shaft as the center. If you are doing the work yourself, be sure you know the different mounting requirements.
When I heard the Beta had a better sump design, I tried to find a used Beta, but never found a single used engine. They sell a fraction of the Yanmar volume, so no surprise.
The 2GM20 is about 16 horsepower (I think); the 3GM30 is 27 hp. Seems 16 hp may be a bit small for the E32, but my only experience is the 22 hp 2QM20 (which I felt had adequate power).
The only downside of my purchase is the trans is a 2.21 ratio -- the 2.62 would have matched the boat and my prop better.
Let me know which direction you go, or if you have any other questions or advice to share. I'll look out for another E32 when I head south from Solomons.
Regards... Philip
Date: August 14, 2014
From: Dick Lathrop
George,
I'm far from an expert on these questions, but I'll share my experience.
When I acquired an E 32 it had a Yamar 2GM20, the boat and the engine were both kind of shabby--a donation from a nice guy who was too ill to keep up with it. The boat had been on the hard for a couple of years.
But everything worked and the engine did well for another year or two until white smoke appeared in the exhaust and I suspected it needed a head gasket.
While agonizing over the expense and the wisdom of throwing this much money into the repair of an old engine in an old boat [in my case, other boat donations were available] a yard manager at Dodson Boat Yard found an engine--a 3GM30--that had been used very little and was available as a donation. So I made the upgrade as described earlier and have been very happy ever since/The 3 cylinder does have more power that the 2, but I always found the power of the 2 adequate. We cruise along at top hull speed either way. If you put any weight on an engine's reputation, you can't beat a Yanmar. Everyone praises them. We have had other boats in our fleet with other brands of diesel engines, and I tend to agree with this praise.
Ask the folks who work in the yards.
