E37 Limber Holes
Date: November 1, 2000
From: A.C. Whitlow, Jr. awhitlow@valottery.state.va.us
Just aft of the V-berth there is a panel in the cabin sole that provides access to the bilge forward of the mast and keel. Directly beneath and aft of this access is a bulkhead (I believe the correct term is "floor") with a large limber hole at the bottom and an additional hole for wiring, etc. Aft of this floor/bulkhead is a large, inaccessible space which is directly forward the water tank and the floor/bulkhead directly aft of the mast. (Is anybody following this?) The problem is that there is nasty, putrid, standing water in this area. It looks (remember I'm lying on my gut, looking aft through the hole for the wires, etc., dying from the smell) as though there is a PIPE for drainage of this area that drains aft under the water tank to God knows where.
The question is, does this sound correct - there is a pipe /tube instead of an old fashioned limber hole? What happened to keep it simple? Any suggestions for draining this water will be greatly appreciated. A coat hanger failed. I think I might try a plumber's snake.
Date: November 2, 2000
From: Mike Miller capnmike@coqui.net
OK, AC, there is a pipe that runs from the forward bilge, under the mast foot, to emerge below and forward of the water tank. You can't see that aft end of it without pulling the tank out. That may be clogged. A plumbers snake should do it. Endeavour left a lot of sawdust in their hulls..... Drainage of the center section where the mast is stepped is nonexistant...a major design/building flaw....water collects in there. If you open the small floor hatch where the speedometer and intake for the head seawater is and feel forward thru the limber hole, you may find water.
The solution is to pull up the two floor sections around the base of the mast, fiberglas a small "dam" about an inch high across this area Forward of the mast so rainwater won't run that way, drill a hole thru the cross-bulkhead aft of the mast and glass a drain tube in there so rainwater coming down the mast will flow thru and run into the bilge forward of the water tank. Then you need to drill-and-tube that section aft and alongside the mast, which Endeavour did not provide with adequate drainage...
If you leave the area wet the cross-bulkheads, which are laminated plywood, will rot and replacing them is Major Surgery!
Date: November 2, 2000
From: Carl Hibbard Chgypsy@aol.com
Hello A.C.,
You are obviously describing a B model 37, do bear in mind that there are a lot of similarities between A & B. The hose you describe would drain the locker/bilge area forward of the mast into the cavity that holds your water tank. ERGO under the raised mast step area.
If your tank is reasonably empty take off the two straps under the floor that hold it down ( mark which was forward and stern rt lft etc) and shift the tank to the stern, you probably will have about an inch maybe two, the fill elbow at the stern of the tank will hit a bulkhead. Now looking down forward of the tank you should see your black hose coming out, you probably have been hitting the water tank with the coat hanger. Some people report that the hose takes an up tilt in the forward cavity allowing water to stand.
You sure that you are not talking about water standing in the raised mast step area? Regards,
Carl Hibbard
Date: November 2, 2000
From: Ed Phillips EPhil49932@aol.com
Hello AC:
I know the exact area you speak of as I have recently replaced my water tank with stainless on my E-37 "B" plan.
The hole you speak of runs thru the bulkheads into the bilge area containing the water tank, from there, it runs along the sides of the water tank, or beneath if possible, to the bulkhead in front of your fuel tank. There is an opening at the bottom of this bulkhead that allows the water to empty into the bilge area around the bottom of the fuel tank where it can be pumped out.
On installation of a new tank I placed (with 5200) nylon 1'' square runners underneath to allow for better drainage, and the ability to hose it out. One thing I remember is that the limber hole exiting into the tank area was very close to the end of the tank, and I think it was the primary reason I raised the new tank up as I was worried about a stoppage. I have plans to put a piece of stainless screen over the front hole.
On mine the lower anchor locker drains via this route, as well as any stray rain water that gets in the bow area, knot meter.
Also, located just in front of the fore limber hole is the 1 and 1/2'' primary drain (overboard) for the head. If this were to leak any sewage, it would also follow the route described above.
I make sure that when I'm at sea and open this thru hull that I plug the limber hole first with a paper towel to catch any drops that come out when opening/closing the valve. I also place a paper towel arond the sea cock that has been dipped in a bleach solution, when done, I wipe up and remove all the towels. So far it works well.....I have included this info because you mentioned a "putrid smell". I don't know if yours is set up like mine, but if it is, you will probley need to do some disinfecting and serious rinsing once it is unplugged.
As far as coat hanger/plumbers snake....sounds good to me...You will probley hit the water tank, but, that should not cause any problem. Lots of luck
Date: November 2, 2000
From: Peter Gradeff gradina@innet.com
Hello AC,
You obviously have Plan B,hence a different view point toward the problem area than mine. I have E37 '83 plan A and had to deal very recently with a case that could be very well similar to yours. If I manage to make myself clear,the following might help.
- The cutout on the floor where the mast goes through is in two sections going around the mast and covering sort of a box underneath 11x17 inches. On the bottom, perhaps about 10 inches from the top floor,there is the fiberglass body of the keel. In my case I found that the mast was seated over a 3/4 inch plywood / why plywood and not directly on the keel ? or why not a metal plate ? / In any event, that plywood was about 85% rotted. I was not aware of this however, because they had built a fiberglass "pan" just over the plywood and all around the mast and the four sides of the box /the aft side being the bulkhead just before the water tank, and I had no idea what was actually under the "pan"
- Seated on the floor above the water tank and looking at the mast ahead,I have a locker on my left /the port side/. On the floor in front of the locker, there is 11x11 inch panel accessing two seackocks. From there I can see the bulkhead that is aft the mast and an oval hole through which I can see another bulkhead with a similar oval hole about 3 feet ahead and then another one further ahead. In other words,the flat surface of the keel
there is really divided in three sections, but water in one section will not freely communicate to the other since the oval holes are somewhat above the floor level. When inserting my left hand through the hole and twisting it toward the base of the mast I then discovered an abundance of rotted wood fibers...... - I managed to cut out and discarded the fiberglass "cup" in the box around the mast that was hiding the view of the base. To my amazement I was observing about 3/4 gal of water accumulating there after rain. To make the story short, helpful explanation came from The Forum in one sentence: "The water comes from inside the mast". I could not locate any pipe that should have been there to direct this water to the bilge just aft the bulkhead....so the water was standing there between the two bulkheads...... It is likely that you have somewhat similar case. I will appreciate very much If you kindly let me know how is your mast seated? is the view of the base restricted by a "pan" such as the one I had ?...and especially where is the drain pipe located ?.. as it will help me understand my own case better. Let me know if you have questions I could answer.
PS. Some Clorox into your standing water will kill bacteria and odor. Good Luck.
Date: November 2, 2000
From: Michael King MEK0117@aol.com
A.C.
I live in Norfolk Va and I bought an Endeavour 37 Ketch back in Sept. Even though I don't have a V berth I know the exact part of the boat you're talking about. The broker I bought the boat from showed me the area you are talking about as he pointed out that the seller had the wood bulkhead replaced. He said he didn't realize this was a problem area until the seller was going over with him all the latest work that was done to the boat. I'll ask him if he knows how to address the problem. As soon as I get some sort of an answer I'll drop you a line. Where are you located?
Date: November 6, 2000
From: Lawrence Frank lrf47@aol.com
Hi
I also have an End. 37 1981. Found say problem as yours. There is a rubber hose epoxied into the step of the mast, this hose will clog easily. One end is covered by water tank and other end is in hull compartment with no access. Hull compartment is adjacent to the shower floor in the head. I found two different ways to clean this line. They are as follows:
Remove water tank, snake and use wet/dry vacuum.
Wet\dry vacuum using soft 3/4" clear plastic tubing coming from forward access compartment to the mast step/base.
Debris found in compartment was, delaminated plywood from wall liner of the head, including other small pieces of wood from original construction.
Date: November 11, 2000
From: Steve Helmers stevhelm@home.com
I had the same problem. My A/C drains into this area and would not go through to the lower bilge. Use the plumbers snake, its the only thing that would work for me. Good Luck
