E42 Fuel Tank Replacement
Date: November 29, 2000
From: Fred H. Lowe frederick.h.lowe1@jsc.nasa.gov
I would like to know how hard it is to get the fuel tank out. It is under the sink in a 1988 E 42 Does anybody know of this tank leaking. And how did they fix it? Thanks.
Date: December 5, 2000
From: Ed Mahoney ed.mahoney@us.abb.com
Hi Fred,
Funny you should mention it, I was concerned about the Fuel tank leaking in my E-42, 1986, Hull number 155, as I found what I consider a design defect.
I had an aft water tank leak that caused me to check it out. Endeavour must have moved the tanks slightly from 1986 to 1988, because my fuel tank is actually slightly forward of the Sink, and the aft water tank is directly under the sink.
I removed the aft water tank this year when I installed a genset under the sink. I felt that since I had good reason to question the integrity of the tank when early this year I found very polluted water in the tank, and after the normal clean and flush, I could not solve the problem. To install the Genset, I had to remove the shelf under the sink, and this made the removal of the tank a matter of cutting the glass bonding and lifting. The tank had some corrosion on the forward port corner, which was the only mark on the tank. The boat has spent all it's time on the Great Lakes, so I have only fresh water, but in salt water this would have been a bigger problem. I had the tank rewelded, and the problem is gone.
The source of the corrosion came from a SST fastener that somehow got trapped at the edge, but the real source is the fact that the tanks are glassed into the bottom of the boat, with about 1/2" gap between them, and bilge water can run into the gap when healed, and had no way out. This was also the source of a rather nasty odor, that I have been fighting for a few years. I would never have noticed the gap had I not been putting in the Genset.
I was unable to come up with a way to eliminate the problem, as summer is short here, but I did drain the area using an oil change pump, and temporarily plugged the gap using some foam pipe covering pushed into the gap.
In the spring, I intend to lift the forward flooring, and lift the fuel tank, and check it out, and then fix the gap permanently.
The problem is these tanks have about 1/4" gap under them, and there is no way for any trapped liquid to leave the area.
One suggestion made by one of the guys at my club was to thoroughly clean the area, and then fill it with West System with water proofing and Micro balloons, sort of like creating a Fiberglass tank with an aluminum liner. Any thoughts on this one?
If I get any other ideas, I will pass them on.
Date: December 7, 2000
From: Jerry Bernath bernathj@pocketmail.com
Surprised that you had the problem. I have a 1988 and I thought they changed that tank to a water tank in 1987. Oh well, I have good & bad news for you. The good news is the solution does exist. The bad is that there is only one given the following:
E42 Pround Mary had it cut out of the hull and replaced by Masonboro Boatyard in Wilmington, NC. Talk to Walter at 910-791-1893, he did the job.
E42 Marnell IV also had it cut out and replaced.
E40 Pinball owned by Tom Powers did the same.
I heard that someone? just stopped using this tank and converted one of the two water tanks to fuel. They had a config like mine which has a 60-75 gal tank jusy below the companionway steps and a 105 gal tank foward of that. Thats about all I can tell you.
Date: March 14, 2001
From: Ed Piriczky sail-sugar@webtv.net
As for the structural integrity of the keel, stay out of the ballast in both ends and you will be all right. Don't cut any closer to the bottom than 1.5 in. Why don't you clean up your old tank, fiberglass the out side ( with epoxy) and put it back in. You need to keep the water off the top of the tank. I locked mine back down with foam sprayed allaround it Any questions ... feel free
Date: March 20, 2001
From: Jerry Bernath bernathj@pocketmail.com
Greetings from George Town, Exumas, Bahamas. Several E42 vessels have done the tank replacements. Suggest you contact Proud Mary in New Bern, NC. They had the job done by Masonboro Boat Yard in Wilmington, NC. You could call Walter at 910-791-1893. He did the job.
Date: April 16, 2001 Hello to all and I hope that anyone who has removed and changed the fuel tank on a 42 would relay their experience to us. We are removing the tank ourselves since we were getting water into the fuel, 20 to 30 gallons were removed. To accomplish this "little" task, we first had to remove the water tank under the salon sole and then the water tank, in front of and adjacent to the fuel tank. Both the 2nd water tank and the fuel tank are in the keel, foamed and fiber glassed on the edges of the tank. Let me say this is not an easy task, but if we want to sail, we are doing the grunt work ourselves and having the yard do the fuel tank out of either epoxy or have them install a custom polypropylene tank. Once the tank is fuel removed, are there any suggestions on securing the tank in place. This is especially tricky since the tank runs aft under the pan of the engine. We have found that clumping kitty litter is great for absorbing any water or fuel left in the bilge. I must say that I have become quite accomplished with a saw zall. Since I am smaller the my husband, I fit in some of the smaller spots and angles a bit more easily. We work together well and want to complete this final enormous task in order to put the boat back together and get some sailing in this season. Any suggestions aside of cutting the keel reach the tank would be appreciated. We will be replacing the most forward water tank with two tanks and make a space between them with a large conduit which will accommodate all of the wires coming down the mast.. Just now they travel through the setee(ours is round) and across the first water tank from port to starboard. Hoping to hear from you all soon!
Date: April 17, 2001 Just a note to the Forum relating to the diesel tanks. Our "fix" of sealing the top of the tank did not work. We are now in the process of removing all of the tanks and replacing them. We are still undecided as to the composition of the fuel tank, but are leaning toward an epoxy integral tank with polystyrene? tanks for the water. We are taking photographs of some of the work, and if anyone else is facing this project, give us a shout and we'll exchange information.
Date: February 8, 2002 I have removed the water & fuel tank from the keel I am going to raise the engine & cut away the drip pan. Then I am going to epoxy in several baffles and a top to make this an integral tank, this will be one large tank that I am going to use for water. Then I am going to plumb the water tank that is beneath the salon floor for fuel. Any suggestions would be helpful. Date: March 12, 2005 Without going into our trip, we “lost” AZZURRA’s fuel tank and keel water tank on Memorial Day weekend, 2004 while getting our butts kicked in 25-knot winds going from Wilmington to Cape Lookout. We started mid-May with the project. Our E42 had the circular settee arrangement, which looks good, but really is not practicable, so we made the MAJOR decision to tear the port side settee out. My wife also felt that if we were going to replace the aluminum water tank in the keel, she didn’t want the aluminum belly tank either, which also would require that the circular settee be removed because it is installed on the sub-floor over the belly tank. First order was acquiring the tools that would be needed. You probably already have chisels, a file to keep them sharp, drill and bits, crowbar and hammer. Two power tools are absolutes. The most important will be a reciprocating saw and you need a certain model. Get a Porter Cable with a 90 degree pivoting body, which also has a 360-degree rotating head. This model gives the most flexibility, and believe me, you’ll need it. Don’t get any other saw! Second is a small circular saw. I got one with a 4-3/8” blade. With a carbide blade, this allows you to cut aluminum. Also, get shrimper’s boots and a supply of Tyvek full body suits. This is going to be a nasty job. Since you’ll be in a confined area and cutting metal, its going to be loud, so get comfortable ear protection along with a FULL face shield. Finally, get a large container of self-clumping kitty litter. This is great for absorbing the last of the water and diesel fuel that is left in the tank. It goes without saying, “pump all water and diesel from the tanks.” The project starts with removing the Teak & Holly plywood in the saloon. Remove the screws, and pry the plywood up. The factory also used glue, but it gave way with no problems. With the sub-floor exposed, it was time to tackle the settee. It “hurt” to take a saw to perfectly good cabinetry. With the fiberglass liner that made up the settee now gone, I was able to take up the sub-floor. This exposed three 2x3 cross-members over the belly tank that would have to be taken out. The Porter made quick work of this. With the tank lifted out, take the circular saw and cut the tank in half length-wise, so that it will fit through the companionway. Be sure to wear a full-face shield and the Tyvek suit, because aluminum chips are flying everywhere. Important is to then replace these cross-members, because when you cut the main cross-member over the keel tanks, the boat will want to “collapse” a little. Mr. Porter then is used to cut the main cross-member to provide access to the keel tanks. I cut them just at the turn of the bilge. Porter then is used to cut the top of the keel water tank out. This is where the job really starts. Get into the tank. There is barely room to stand. With the circular saw set to a depth just greater than the thickness of the aluminum, make cuts straight down toward your toes. Make cuts every 6 inches or less. Then make a horizontal cut as low as you can get the saw. Then take the crowbar, and pry a section away from the bilge wall. This is when you have to be ready. The stench that hits you will knock you out. Think about it. Stagnate salt water, in foam, for 15 years. Mix in a little diesel that might have leaked from the fuel tank and you have an odor that makes any sewer plant smell good. Try not to use the Porter here. That blade, inches away from my bilge wall, made me uncomfortable, but sometimes I had to. The sides and the forward and rear walls came out straight forward, but getting the corners of the tank took a few curse words. I might also mention that the wall between the water and fuel tank was so thin that I could poke a hole in it with my little finger. At the point that the top 2/3’s of the tank had been cut away, I bent all four sides inward and drilled a hole in the center of each side. I then put an anchor bolt into each, connected them with a bridle, and with a 2x4 over the companionway, attached my mainsheet blocks to the bridle. You could hear the suction break as I lifted the tank up. And I might also mention, a whole new odor arose from the bottom of my boat. With this tank removed, you could really see how the factory chose to make our lives miserable 15 years later. They dropped 90mil aluminum tanks, of approximate shape, into the open keel, poured 6 inches of resin around the tanks to lock in the foot of the tanks, and then poured foam into the rest of the cavity. Then they took fiberglass and laid this from the turn of the bilge to the top of the tanks. Every drop of seawater from the stuffing box flowed over the top of the fuel tank to the little bilge reservoir that they molded in beside the fuel tank. A guaranteed recipe for corrosion. Now, tackle the fuel tank. With Mr. Porter, cut the forward end out, but leave the bottom 6 inches (you’ll need this later). Now is also the time to use the kitty litter. That did a great job of cleaning up the bottom of the fuel tank, because that is going to be “home” for quite a few hours. Here is where I went and purchased some good kneepads. I might mention here that the front of the fuel tank is about 13 inches wide on the bottom and the rear is 3 inches wide. If you weigh 250 pounds, you’re not going to be able to do this job. Take the Porter and from inside the tank, cut the top out as far as you can go back. I found that it worked best to take out small sections at a time because you could bend them down easier. Also, sometimes you’ll need to work a bend up and down to break it instead of cutting it with the saw. With the top cut out, you then start cutting out the sides. This is done similar to the water tank; it’s just that you are now working on your knees under the engine. Again, I cut the sides down as low as I could, working both sides as I went. Do both sides because it gives you more shoulder room as you work to the rear. Remember that there are 1 to 2 inches of foam that is outside of the tank wall that you are taking out also. In areas, this foam was black and oily from where the diesel had leaked into it from corrosion pinholes. You will have to get inside the tank and keep working aft, cutting the top and then the sides. When the sides are cut as low as space will allow, you should be able to pull the whole tank forward. I was able to grab that 6-inch lip left from the front wall and pull the remaining tank loose. With the tank pulled forward, and no longer against the back bilge wall, the Porter can be used to cut the back wall out. With this gone, you can pull the whole tank forward and up into the saloon area, and then out the companionway. The next job was as taxing as any of the first. With your chisels (and keep them sharp), its time to work on the shoulder of resin that is left in the bottom of the bilge. This was 1 to 2 inches thick and 4 to 6 inches high around the entire bilge. Sometimes it would break free from the side or bottom of the bilge clean and in big chunks and other times, I had to chisel every inch. Here also, it’s very important to wear a face shield. With all of this out of the way, its time to measure, and measure carefully. I had a custom fiberglass tank built locally to fit the bilge and it was designed to sit on a raised floor sitting on “high ledgers. The tank was placed with” space at the aft end also so that water from the stuffing box could flow behind and then under the tank. A fitted wedge of Plexiglas was taped into the back part of the keel so that I could seal this area with tape to keep the foam that I would be using from filling up this” space. When the tank was ready for installation, I had to cut the cabinet under the companionway to allow for the full height of the new tank while it was being inserted. Actually, the critical height measurement is what will come through the companionway. I decided to make this new opening into a removable door, which could then be used to access the (to be) DC generator that will be my next project. I sealed the area around the tank (bottom, aft before the tank was inserted and forward after insertion) with tape and poured foam into the sides to lock that tank in place. The forward end of the tank was glassed to the keel walls and the top was glassed to the engine pan. Duraweld in Jupiter, Florida built the polyethylene plastic water tanks (www.dura-weld.com). I used 3/8” plastic to provide for a more substantial tank. The keel tank was sized to fit in front of the fuel tank and also to sit on ledgers. It is also higher than the turn of the bilge, with a notch-out for the main cross-member. No water is going to flow over this tank. I left the forward 10 inches of the keel open so that I would have a REAL deep bilge. Duraweld did a great job of building EXACTLY what I ordered. The tanks fitted perfectly. A plywood bulkhead was fiberglass and then glassed into the keel to lock the water tank in. This tank also had foam poured around it. The boat’s main cross-member over the water tank was glassed back in and I used a laminated beam from the construction industry to “sister” this important structural member. The belly tanks had to be built as two because of the companionway constraints. I left 6 inches between the tanks, which allows for a chase for plumbing and wiring. I glassed in two plywood bulkheads to run fore-an-aft to form this 6 inch channel and to support the two tanks. To make up for losing this volume, I made the tanks 1-inch taller than the original tank. I again used laminated beams to replace the original 2x3 beams over these tanks since the beams had to be an inch narrower. The sub-floor is back in and ready to be screwed down permanently. I will not be able to use the original teak & holly plywood because the circular settee cut into it. I will have to replace it new plywood, which of course is 1/16 thinner and has different widths for the T&H. While doing this project, I also replaced the water fill tubes, put new deck fittings in, replaced all plumbing tubing with 3/8” PEK and Flare-It fittings and added a new 12 gallon stainless steel tank hot water heater. All in all, an interesting summer, fall and winter. I do think we’ll be able to do our Memorial Day weekend trip again. Good sailing! Date: May 15, 2007 In the May 2007 issue of Practical sailor <http://www.practical-sailor.com/> there is an in depth article exploring the ideal fuel tank replacement. It looks at the prosand cons of various materials, construction methods, and ways of minimizing corrosion in the first place. Date: April 30, 2011 We replaced all of our water & fuel tanks in our E42.For a complete summay see our blog at : http://svwandrinstar.blogspot.com/2010/12/i-was-filling-water-tanks-when-i-heard.html
From: Donna Cass bacchus42@earthlink.net
From: Donna Cass bacchus42@earthlink.net
From: Keith Childs keithcath7@msn.com
From: Brewer Ezzell BEzzell@murphyfarms.com
From: Paul Uhl endvr32@endeavourowners.com
From: Steve Steakley
http://svwandrinstar.blogspot.com/2010/12/endeavour-42-tank-replacement-phase-ii.html
http://svwandrinstar.blogspot.com/2011_03_01_archive.html
